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I’d like to issue a challenge. I have the Crowe Chizek paper in my hands dated March 7, 2006 stated the NPV value of the project being $1.9 Billion, not 11billion. This paper is the one most quoted in newspapers about how the state received twice the projected value. Seeing how the state received 3.8Billion, it seems to me that it was a good deal.

Please show me how this deal was worth $11 B.

Thanks,
Jenny Barton

I was refering to a paradigm shift in thinking. Noone can debate the havoc America has wrought on Iraq in recent times. The conscience of America feels that this is inexusable. There are no grounds for killing innocents for their own good [that was the justification given to bombing civilian targets - regardless of whether they were dressed as military ones]. There are no excuses, justifications, attributions for that. Only denial will suffice and placate those determined to circumvent their conscience (aka God).

Iraq has given the World, the global community, a real opportunity to consider capitalism, religion, inter relationships between global human beings. The innocents who have been murdered by the coalition of willing murderers will not have died in vain, if humanity wakes up as a result of this catastrophy. The tell tale signs are not in Iraq but can be seen in the manifestation of infrastucture - our hallowed corporations. These entities who have the rights of super humans are the root of the problem. The real menace will not cease with the end of agression in Iraq. A world without war is a world without a war waiting to happen. War is only a manifestation of a breakdown of inter relationships. Only by determining where the relationship broke down can you being to provide a surable remedy.

This, at the most basic level, far from being resolved is being aggrevated. That is why this is the second american bridge [sybolic of 1000's of metaphorical ones] to colapse in not so many years. In time there will be many more, because those who bluster importance, provaricate the safety of their constituents are the subjects of super humans who are above humanity.

“There was a surplus when Clinton left office. It was not being used for infrastructure maintainence. For Bush to squander that surplus the congress had to help. The voice of the people spoke and the money went for purpose A instead of purpose B.”

The point is, had there been a surplus in 2005 when the bridge needed replacing, the money would have been available, and Bush and the Republicans came to office promising a balanced budget. Thanks to the machinations of the GOP, the media, and the Democrats, the people hardly were able to make an informed decision.

“The state sector can defund maintainence, because if something falls down no one is held responsible. If that bridge had been a private toll bridge and had fallen down, the lawsuits and insurance payouts would already be working.”

But the bridge would still have collapsed and the people still would have died.

“It was a state product so Minnesota gets a visit from someone from DC and all the ’serious voices’ go into harmony on ‘not pointing fingers.’”

“Not pointing fingers” has been a relatively recent phenomenon of government, a political fillip introduced by the Bush neocons to diffuse blame for their horrendous ineptitude. Up until recently, people in our government were held responsible for their failures. We should return to that ‘era of responsibility.’

“‘Privatization isn’t the answer; there are some things that are so important they can’t be left up to the whims of the market.’ Mindless cant does not do justice to the rest of your response.”

It isn’t mere ‘mindless cant’ as you’ll see if you keep reading.

“Various states are privatizing the freeways and bridges.”

Yes, they are. Among the firms pushing this privatization are Goldman Sachs and The Carlyle Group, the latter a company from which the Bush family turns a nice profit. In Indiana, former Bush sycophant and current in-debt Republican governor Mitch Daniels recently signed a deal to sell the Indiana Toll Road system to a consortium of Spanish and Australian companies for over $3 billion dollars. The consortium will run the state’s toll roads for 75 years. Sounds good until you discover that, over that same period of time, Indiana could have realized $11 billion from its toll roads. The weakness in any privatization of roads and bridges is obvious — what happens if certain roads and bridges aren’t profitable — are they closed down or just left to fall apart? Or does the state, at great expense, assume ownership again? You may not care about this — unless it happens to be the road that runs in front of your house or is your only access to the highway.

“Private Education produces better eductated men and women than does public education.”

Really. Abraham Lincoln, Mark Twain, Ernest Hemingway and Harry Truman were all products of American public schools. The current occupant of the Oval Office, and his brothers Jeb, Marvin and Neil, all graduated from some of the finest private schools in the nation. I rest my case.

“Private arbitration provides faster and more equitable settlements among equals than does Public Law.”

Not necessarily. Would you want murderers, thieves and rapists subjected to binding arbitration?

“Private mail delivery likewise compared to the USPS.”

This has yet to be proven. Certainly bureaucracy has hurt the USPS in the past twenty years, but it has operated much more efficiently in the past.

“There really is nothing other than aggressive war that private services cannot do better than state enforced theft and mayhem.”

Why wouldn’t private services do that better, as well? As we’ve seen in Iraq, of course, private companies are not more efficient at making war or delivering vital services to the troops.

“The ‘whims of the market’ really means the unforced decisions of producers and consumers each acting in their own perceived best interests right?”

That is the Libertarian ‘free market’ ideal which has yet to be proven to work in any country on Earth. The ‘global economy’ is, in fact, not a free market, but a closed market, with all of its encumbering rules and fiats enforced by the WTO and various treaties; it should more properly be termed communism for corporatists.

“So what is necessary is to replace productive people with an elite of decision makers who are not subject to whimsy; serious folk who love theft and war and misery and secrets?”

You are talking here about the Bush Regime; past American governments, administered by smarter people, have done better.

“Your examples are interesting, all of them relate to state enterprise or state controlled markets. Prisons, war contracting, pharmaceuticals, decrepit wharehouses for throwaway children, mercenaries.”

No, they related to the privatization of a public service which turned out to be a failure when the corporation discovered it couldn’t make a profit. Our for-profit health care system is a prime example; without going into a long diatribe, suffice it to say that I don’t know of one American with good private health insurance who likes our US system; meanwhile I know of two Canadians, both of whom are insured through their jobs with American companies, who prefer going home to Canada for medical treatment.

“And Ford which actually had to pay a bit for its bad engineering, a governmentally determined bit.”

Yet the company is still in business and no one went to jail. If a member of your family had the misfortune to be in one of those exploding Pintos would you have been as sanguine about Ford merely paying a fine for an easily-correctable problem with the car’s gas tank of which they were well aware?

“I am not a big supporter of publicly funded police or fire departments.”

Good, then should you have an emergency requiring the police, I trust you’ll hire your own private company to handle the problem, relieving the rest of us of paying for your security. Should you have a fire, and your priavte company refuses to respond because you can’t afford to pay them what they want, and the entire neighborhood burns down while you’re dickering with them on the phone, that’s just another unfortunate offering on the altar free enterprise.

“They appear to have done little to reduce crimes against people or the incidence of fire certainly less than those pesky private insurance companies.”

Neither have private firms.

“Next time I drive over a bridge, I will have to wonder if some state or federal theif decided to let it rust for another year…an actual consideration not a hypothetical.”

Or, if it’s privatized, you’ll have to wonder if someone cut corners to insure its profitability. That’s not a hypothetical, either.

“A privately built bridge makes its profits from continuing to stand and transport people, so yes I think I would trust something where there is a specific vested interest in its continued successful and uninterrupted operation, than a state funded forgettable.”

Unless, for whatever reason, the bridge is not making enough return on its investment. We have seen, with Enron, et al, that any public service is quickly abandoned by a corporation if it is not bringing in sufficient profit. Do you want the American landscape littered with rusted-out bridges and stretches of impassable washboard roads that a corporation couldn’t make profitable? Our problem is with the government-hating neocons in the Bush administration who don’t want the government to work, except for themselves.

Incidentally, CK, have you read that Bush has been privatizing national intelligence? Read “Outsourcing Intelligence: How Bush Gets His National Intelligence from Private Companies,” by R.J. Hillhouse. That’s been working out well, hasn’t it?

I’ll say it again: Some things are too important to be left to the whims of the marketplace.

“Where is Bill Clinton when we need him. He could feel the pain better than anyone I ever saw — not do squat about it.”

Whatever you might say about Clinton, we had a surplus when he left office and plenty of money to fix or replace bridges. Bush squandered that on tax cuts for his wealthy friends and his Iraq disaster.

“You get the level of reliability you regulate to so let us not have any finger pointing when regulated crap falls down and goes boom.”

The problem here wasn’t regulation, it was the Bush government not following regulations. In 2005, the DoT recommended that stretch of bridge on I-35W in Minnesota be replaced but the money wasn’t there.

“So the victims participated in electing a person who promised not to thieve from their gas purchases…”

In electing Tim Pawlenty, the people thought they were getting a responsible and competent governor who wouldn’t let their bridges collapse and not an incompetent Bush Republican. If you surveyed Minnesotans, I’m positive the majority would rather pay the few cents per gallon increase to make sure the bridges they drive on don’t suddenly fall into the river. (For that matter, if Bush hadn’t so badly bungled the economy, Pawlenty wouldn’t have had to veto that gas tax increase — it wouldn’t have been needed.) Privatization isn’t the answer; there are some things that are so important they can’t be left up to the whims of the market. The Edison Project’s failed ‘privatized’ public schools is one example; the for-profit prison systems around the country another; the Blackwater mercenaries in Iraq who are more trouble than they’re worth is yet another. To borrow a line from Michael Moore, would you want your local fire and police departments to have to check with a corporation to see if it’s profitable to save your burning house or your life? Next time you’re driving on a bridge over an 500-foot drop ravine, do you want to wonder whether someone cut corners to make a bigger profit for the company that owns it?

And, contrary to your implication, when a corporation fails to do its job, it is often not held responsible in any meaningful way. Just look at Halliburton’s providing shoddy services and ‘losing’ billions of dollars in Iraq; the recent Vioxx case; and the Ford Pinto’s exploding gas tank from 30 years ago. No top executive went to jail, or even got fired, and the fines didn’t bankrupt the company. Indeed, Halliburton still has a lucrative contract with our government, even though their ’services’ have been terrible.

I agree with you, though, on sports stadiums — public money shouldn’t be used to enhance the profits of a private enterprise.