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How She Did It: True Grit and “Intellectual Poise”

Jason Horowitz of The Observer asked adviser Sidney Blumenthal about Hillary Clinton’s victory in New Hampshire. Was it an emphasis on her personality, he inquired. Blumenthal rejected the question’s premise:

“I don’t buy any of this,” he said. “I’m not interested in this discussion. I think that policy matters and I think that who she is matters and I don’t see the difference.”

“I think this was personal triumph for her. She walked through the furnace and came out.”

Blumenthal said the win was a testament to Clinton’s “grit.”

“Look, she is sleeping two hours a night,” he said. “She has to have the stamina to keep going, she has to have the morale to keep going, she showed she has the intellectual poise to access and figure out what’s happening as it’s happening, to learn lessons immediately.”

What else contributed to Hillary Clinton’s win? The campaign had a superb “ground game” in New Hampshire. Most of all, it was women and independents (yes, independents!) who rallied to Sen. Clinton — including women who thought the male candidates “piled on” Sen. Clinton during the Saturday debate before Tuesday’s election. And, fascinating statistics show that it was young women, those women of the more mature ages of 25 to 29, who turned out for Hillary Clinton.

About that Saturday debate, Taylor Marsh took note of Sen. Barack Obama’s ungracious response in this sequence:

A question went to Hillary about change and the tag teaming going on between Edwards and Obama against her, implying that she has a problem with likability.

“Well, that hurts my feelings, but I’ll try to go on.” - Hillary Clinton

After a moment or two, Obama responded,”You’re likeable enough.” He was looking down when he said it, with the camera catching the reaction, which revealed a quite ungracious moment for Obama.

Then, following Sen. Clinton’s emotional exchange with women voters during which she had tears in her eyes, John Edwards was critical and harsh. Worse, Barack Obama declined to say anything about the exchange.

Politico dissected the fascinating statistics about young women who sided with Hillary Clinton:

Obama easily beat Clinton among 18- to 24-year-olds in New Hampshire, 60 percent to 27 percent. But Clinton surprised observers by actually edging out Obama among 25- to 29-year-olds, 37 percent to 35 percent.

Her edge among voters between 25 and 29 was a crucial component of her 39 percent to 37 percent victory.

There are at least three potential explanations for the difference between the under-25 and the over-25 vote: that the nature of Clinton’s pitch to young voters had more appeal to voters in their late 20s; that 25 is about the age at which Clinton nostalgia may still kick in; and that Obama had a stronger organization on campus, while Clinton had a better field operation in the cities where young adults are most likely to live.

Then there are the statistics on independent voters, with Sen. Clinton carrying more independents than Sen. McCain:

The key stat:
Number of independent votes that McCain won: 33,063
Number of independent votes that Clinton won: 40,111

Today’s Wall Street Journal article, “Clinton’s Victory Resonates With Women,” tells us more about how women identify with Sen. Clinton:

Anne Skinner, a 58-year old waitress in Tuxedo Park, N.Y., felt a whiff of solidarity with Hillary Clinton yesterday.

“I was relieved,” she said of Mrs. Clinton’s unexpected primary win in New Hampshire. “I don’t think men understand how hard it is for women, how hard we work and how important we are. I think it’ll be good for us.” […]

“Hillary has become, in a weird way, more of a hero to women for being down, counted out, standing up and fighting back,” said Susan Estrich, a political strategist and former campaign manager for Michael Dukakis. “Beforehand, people said she didn’t deserve the nomination because it was being handed to her. Now she’s like us because in the end nothing gets handed to women.

About that moment, Taylor Marsh eloquently writes in “Emotional Clinton on the Trail”:

[P]eople know when something is contrived. There is no doubt that she’s exhausted and the wall politicians usually erect completely falls in this exchange. She shared her honest feelings with the voters, revealing the Hillary people who’ve known her for years says is behind the politician we see every day. It’s a continuation of the “That hurts my feelings,” likability moment during the debate on Saturday, which was delivered so flawlessly. There’s a part of Hillary Clinton that has not been revealed to the public. It’s who she is and people need to meet that part of her. It was a very real moment. … (Read all.)

The last part of today’s WSJ article is a reminder of just how difficult it is to be a female candidate, elected official, or executive:

As a woman, Sen. [Claire] McCaskill said, “when you start in a hole, in how you’re perceived in terms of your competence, you can check too much of your personality and vulnerability at the door in a quest to look, talk and act like a CEO. When I ran for governor, I was so busy knowing the answers to all the questions that I forgot to tell them how important my mom was to me. It’s important that people see you as a multidimensional being and not as a cartoon character. I don’t think that’s the easiest thing in the world for Hillary. If you’re too buttoned up, people can’t relate to you.”

Pat Cook, president of Cook & Co. a boutique executive-recruiting firm in Bronxville, N.Y., said Mrs. Clinton has “been perceived as way too steely, too emotionless, but when she got a little teary she looked normal, like a real person with a soul who cares.”

That makes Mrs. Clinton a good role model for women seeking to advance in business or elsewhere, Ms. Cook said. “I tell them they’ll never be able to keep up a tough persona, and if they try they’ll just become an immediate target of men who want to brand women with the ‘B’ word as soon as they get any power,” she said.

Carol Bellamy, a former top New York City official and executive director of UNICEF, said Mrs. Clinton’s victory reminded her of the advice she gives younger women in politics and business: “You’re a human being. Be comfortable in your decision. Be comfortable in your skin.”

It’s quite a balancing act. And one that only another woman can know.

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Comment by KnowVox | 2008-01-10 23:15:30

EXCELLENT analysis, Susan. I’m frankly sick and tired of pundits claiming she carried New Hampshire on anything besides “true grit and intellectual poise.” As Blumenthal said, “She walked through the furnace and came out.” That pretty much says it all. No gimmicks, no tricks, nothing but hard damn work. That’s Hillary.

 

Comment by Ardie | 2008-01-10 23:27:04

If Bloomberg decides to run, Hillary has the election in the bag. Women, tired to being second class citizens, will vote for Hillary–the male vote will split between Bloomberg and the Republican candidate. In addition, if Bloomberg decides to run, Hillary can select Valerie Plame Wilson to be her Vice President! Now that would be a kick-ass ticket!

 

Comment by Mad Dogs | 2008-01-10 23:30:07

Great post Susan!

While my preference has been John Edwards, I was (like many) somehow rooting for Hillary to win in NH. And that still surprises me. *g*

I posted this on another blog before Hillary’s win in New Hampshire that may explain why I cheered on her victory:

Obama seems to be the flip side of the very same coin as Junya.

What does that mean you ask? I’m glad you did!

Junya says everything wrong and can’t deliver.
Obama says everything right and won’t be able to deliver.
The “coin”, you see, is not being able to deliver.

This surge of Obama’s reminds me that a majority of Americans believe in “angels”. I’m guessing that the majority of Americans still believe in Santa Claus too.

This American wish/dream/obsession for a “bed of roses” wrt Obama seems made more out of desperation than it does out of a conviction that our outcome will be positive. A plea for help rather than an assuredness of success.

I am not liking what I detect in the psyche of the American public these days, and in particular, those who are stampeding to the standard of the Democrat Obama.

I ask myself, what in the world are these folks smoking? And the answer seems to me, is “Hope-a-dope”.

Yes, Obama has touched “something”.

But it seems to me that what he’s touched is this unreasoning yearning for a “savior” (as in Oh lawdy, save us, we’re drowning!) rather than a rational analysis that this person is up to the job, has thought deeply about the issues and knows how to fix the things that are wrong…with us.

As a life-long Democrat, I close this lament by saying:

“It’s my party and I’ll cry if I want to, cry if I want to…”

And note after Hillary’s win in NH, I take back not one word of this.

And yes, I still prefer John Edwards.

 

Comment by Mr.Murder | 2008-01-10 23:58:08

Well, one would expect harsh words from political opposition in this day and age.

She couldn’t bake cookies and be nice, the press bus was proof enough of that.

Be who you are, what got you to this point? Being a ball breaker, the backroom bully that gave Bill Clinton the fire in his belly to win tough.

It’s not going to get any easier.

Remember when your Husband lost as an incumbent Governor in Arkansas after you had an ambitious teacher testing program initiated and the teachers’ union set you back? Frank White took the Governor’s office.

You husband still gets red faced over that.

Members of my household voted against you once for that in unison. Now you’ve got a union buster helping push your agenda?

Step back into the light. Remember the time when you reasserted to connect with those teachers and meet their needs to improve education. People in our state had to learn it the hard way, you left office and the next Gov. stripped education down as best he could. Bill came back and reclaimed higher ground, he was better because of his experiences.

Experience matters.

You addressed reform and did not leave it as an unfunded mandate. Remind people that you met those demands within the framework of a balanced budget, then did the same nationally.

Size matters.

You learned how to take bold new steps on a state level, challenging convention and authority to shape government anew, then you took many of those ideas to a bigger format and made them work for America as a whole.

What other Democrat has the same track record to engineer positive change to the extent you did within Arkansas? None of them do to the level you have done. It’s hard to talk of national success when they have yet to make the same impact at the state level as your husband’s years in office did with your help.

You know how to implement change better than any of the candidates out there, this time you don’t have people like Newt Gingrich in the way with numbers enough to restrict the ability to cultivate positive growth.

You’ve got all the advantages within your political arsenal. Power in and of itself, for power’s sake, is not what makes a great leader. Understanding how to apply power is what makes the difference.

Surgeons have the tasks mastered through knowledge and technology. A tool in their hands can save lives. Their hands are directed by previous experience, as well by a time tested approach that precedes their days, also by new ideas in applied science.

Someone with a balance of these traits is best fit to approach healing America.

You have the experience, an understanding of working in government at its highest level, and you’ve kept pace with the transformative new century and the new ways to lead America forward.

Be who you are, that won you the race in New Hampshire. You have more traits that can be called upon when facing any challenge.

Americans are seeing through the media. They can’t control the narrative any longer, to the extent the media co-opts its message even more to undue influence and Americans grow more cynical of its message.

Comment by gqmartinez | 2008-01-11 00:28:48

Wow. Great comment. It’s so frustrating that we have to talk so much about the horse race and not the policy details. When we were doing this in the late summer and most of the fall, Hillary was kicking tail because few could compete with her on knowledge, smarts and experience getting things done. Once the media turned to the horse race, they were able make this about how lovable Barack Obama, with his big ears and infectious optimism were and how cold and calculating Hillary is supposed to be.

Hillary can connect with the people if she gets a chance to talk about why she does what she does, what she has done, and what she wants to do. I don’t think the media wants us to get back to that, but you’re right, the people can see through the media–and blogger–nonsense.

Comment by Chris Vosburg | 2008-01-11 10:33:56

Hillary, back in ‘94 I think, had a chat with the press in the white house, in which she deftly took all comers and questions, about everything from her Rose law firm billing records to Whitewater to Socks the Cat.

Famously, she referred to a “vast right-wing conspiracy” driving the various “scandals” and “controversies” and in a turn of phrase I’ll never forget, referred to the press coverage of it as “beating this like the deadest horse that it is”.

In short, she made monkeys of ‘em. Although she picked up some good press in the aftermath, and praise for her poise under fire, it didn’t last long. It finally dawned on the press, the dopes: hey, waitaminute, she’s talking about us!

The resentment persists from that, I think, and it’s reminiscent of the whining about Al Gore: thinks he’s smarter than us!

There wasn’t much doubt that Al Gore was, in fact, and I don’t know why this is such a problem with the press, but there it is and there they are: Heathers who buy ink by the gallon.

And a second to what you said, gq: an absolutely terrific comment from Mr Murder.

 
 
 

Comment by Mr.Murder | 2008-01-11 00:57:29

SCOTUS went 5-4 today on Indiana laws made to intimidate and restrict voting.

Comment by hoosierHoops | 2008-01-11 14:09:20

Mr. Murder.. I looked everywhere on the Court ruling and found no references..You would think that it would be front page news in Indiana..Zip..
Are you sure?

 
 

Comment by Bill Keyes | 2008-01-11 01:03:06

(Many of you probably think from my recent posts that I have only a pessimist side about the outcome of this election year. So this post is from my other optimistic side.)

Am I missing something here or has all of a sudden support or not of Hillary become a male/female thing?

I personally love women (no not that way) and have been happily married to the same woman for 41 years. In fact I probably like women’s company better than most men (no I am not a closet gay) because most women can discuss something other than who’s going to win the World Series, the Super bowl etc.

But it angers me that certain asshole male pundents are getting some of you ladies goats. That’s exactly what they are trying to do, it makes for good TV ratings and more money for the Male dominated media giants. If Obama was in the lead they would make it a race issue. Gender, race creed or wealth should have nothing to do with it.

The now apparent three front runners for the Democratic party nomination are 1)a white woman, 2)a black man and 3)a white man.

This is historic for the Democratic party (which has always been the party of the Inclusive and not the party of the Exclusive) because we are seeing for the first time how maybe the two largest of the many minorities in this country, can actually be accepted for who they are and run for the highest office of this land.

Look at us people we have three great candidates for our party’s nomination. Lets build on this diversity and not allow the opposition to try to divide and conquer us. Remember those stirring words attributed to Patrick Henry for one, “United We Stand Divided We Fall.

Yes there will be a lot of rancor and discussion and name calling etc between the three leading Democratic candidates over the next 4-5 weeks, but let us hope that when there is an apparent leader after Super Tuesday, we can all unite behind him/her regardless of whether that candidate is a woman, an African American or a traditional white male.

Lets also further hope, that after Super Tues, Ms Clinton, Mr Obama and Mr Edwards can put their differences behind them and fire the opening shots of the only REAL War that needs to be fought in this country and that is the War to defeat those who have taken our country away from us, we the people.

Comment by shirin | 2008-01-11 03:07:26

Well, technically, females are NOT a minority. As a matter of fact, they are a majority. :o} More males are conceived, fewer survive long enough to be born, and for various reasons males do not live as long as females, therefore, females are more numerous than males.

But I understand what you meant by including females as a minority as they are definitely a minority in positions of national power.

 
 

Comment by GR3 | 2008-01-11 01:07:23

I’ve written before that I will vote for ANY Democratic presidential candidate on the ballot this November. After watching the above Hillary video, I don’t think I’ll have to hold my nose! Because she is capable and qualified, and will help America recover from the imperial presidency of the last eight years.
But there is still the problem with New Hampshire’s Diebold machines. There are too many questions about discrepancies between hand counted ballots and machine counted ballots. http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5544
Are we, the American people, being played?
Obama said he was a civil rights attorney and would challenge any electoral discrepancies. Then why is Kucinich the one paying for a recount in New Hampshire?
I have a really bad feeling about 2008. Sure, the D’s have the numbers. But we’ve seen that before.
I’d recommend John Deans book, Broken Government, to the idealists. It makes a good case for the Republican Party being a criminal enterprise intent on destroying this country. Their accomplices in the media are mentioned in passing.

Comment by TeakWoodKite | 2008-01-11 02:57:00

That book is a great read.

 
 

Comment by Mr.Murder | 2008-01-11 02:56:44

OT:

On the subject of the phone companies and the FBI payments for surveillance,

one would assume the phone companies have no standing to block FOIA on the grounds of Nat’l Security since they block the service rendered over money payments.

Those are our airwaves you’re licensed to provide service for anyways.

In fact it appears a phone company shared confidential information for the purpose of political attacks in flyover country.

June 06, 2007
BELTWAY BLOGROLL

Ky. Prosecutors Investigate Republican Blogger
Reprinted from today’s PM Edition of Technology Daily

By Michael Martinez

Another blog scandal has erupted in the Bluegrass State. Kentucky prosecutors announced this week the launch of a preliminary review into how a Republican political blogger obtained state telephone records that he posted on his site to damage Democratic candidates for statewide office.

The state attorney general’s office is looking into how Brett Hall, a former spokesman for Republican Gov. Ernie Fletcher, accessed records he mentioned in a recent post on his blog, KyPolitics.

http://beltwayblogroll.nationaljournal.com/archives/2007/06/ky_prosecutors.php

Several important items develop on this topic:

A Stumbo spokeswoman would not elaborate on the preliminary probe when asked for comment Wednesday. Conway and Luallen are calling for an independent investigation.

In a post earlier this week, Hall said he is committed to protecting his source. He previously told the Louisville Courier-Journal that he obtained the information through a public-records request but later acknowledged that was a fabrication.

Hmmmm.

Fletcher was at the center of a separate blog controversy last summer. Democratic blogger Mark Nickolas of the BluegrassReport accused Fletcher’s administration in federal court of blocking state employees from reading the blogger’s site for political reasons. Nickolas also managed the failed gubernatorial campaign of now-U.S. Rep. Ben Chandler against Fletcher in 2003.

In a post on Tuesday, Nickolas said he is having a hard time believing that Fletcher had nothing to do with Hall’s predicament. “Another year, another Fletcher scandal concerning improper official conduct,” Nickolas wrote.

Calls to Fletcher’s office were not returned before deadline.

Where is the consistency from telecoms in the matter?

We can’t find out who you let spy on us, only they can’t spy to keep America safe unless they pay you, only it turns out that down to state levels they’re trying to put these items out for political spin and security is not the motivation…

 

Comment by TeakWoodKite | 2008-01-11 03:24:23

Wonder how to get standing to to sue for the telco billing records. Erin Brook ..we need you.
That is from the Jaba the Hut McConnell state?

Wonders never cease. Eminent domain doesn’t work with the telcos?

 

Comment by bob h | 2008-01-11 07:14:15

“If Bloomberg decides to run, Hillary has the election in the bag.”

Women presumably will not be amused by the charges of vulgar sexism that have been made against him while running Bloomberg Inc.

 

Comment by BernieO | 2008-01-11 08:53:48

I think the media’s reaction to Hillary’s supposed crying woke a lot of women up to just how sexist the media’s coverage of Hillary has been. They have begun to realize that what we have been repeatedly told about her is not true.
Yesterday Barbara Walters criticized Chris Matthews for saying that the only reason Hillary was elected Senator was that her husband had cheated on her. Today on Morning Joe, Scarborough and Matthews are hammering Walters. Matthews is offering a lame excuse for his statement. None of them are talking about the fact that this was just one of many sexist statements Matthews has made about Hillary. When Bob Kerrey endorsed her Matthews said he was in danger of becoming a “castrato in the eunuch chorus”. He has referred to her as witchy and a she-devil and compared her to Nurse Ratched
Tucker Carlson has also been outrageous. He even brought up Lorena Bobbitt in a discussion about Hillary and has also said that he crosses his legs when Hillary is on TV! To read more http://plutonium-page.dailykos.com/
Imus was rightly fired for his racist comment. Why is this any more acceptable? NBC is becoming the Neanderthal Broadcasting Network.

 

Comment by bob h | 2008-01-11 09:30:36

Meanwhile, the gathering economic storm (shades of 91-92?) seems tailormade for a Clinton campaign. She “feels pain” just as well as her husband, and comes prepared with convincing stimulus plans. The economically insecure flock to her because they know she is authentic.

As this thing worsens, voters will be moving from the intangible and inspirational to tangible questions about bread and butter.

 

Comment by Diane | 2008-01-11 09:57:12

I will vote for Hillary because I have heard her speak, in person, at a dinner in upstate NY.
She was our newly elected Senator. She spoke without notes for approx. 30+ mins about upstate NY issues and issues facing the US.
She was never derogatory about GW Bush or any other Republican. She knew the issues, she had ideas and she had a vision that was clear and she could articulate.
It is is sharp contrast to any other candidate, Democrat or Republican running today.

I don’t want Obama because I don’t think he has enough experience to get us out of the hell hole that this administration has dug for us.
I will never vote for anybody who believes that the earth is 6,000 years old or that “science” is evil or and that we need to take America back for Jesus.
Even if that person was a great Democrat I could not do it!
People are voting for Hilary because they see that she does have the poise and the experience to get going from day 1 in the White House!!!

 

Comment by Kathleen | 2008-01-11 10:58:31

The only thing I can figure out is that voters in New Hampshire must be PRO WAR. The two pro-war candidates won.

Comment by CK | 2008-01-11 13:30:52

Or the voting machine company and its owners and programmers are pro war. 100 more years of US military occupation of Iraq; 5 generations. Rep Kucinich has paid the fee necessary and called for a complete recount of NH.

 
 

Comment by Chris Vosburg | 2008-01-11 12:16:04

And speaking of “beating this to death like the deadest horse that it is”, I can’t resist throwing in my pair of pennies:

Politico writes: There are at least three potential explanations for the difference between the under-25 and the over-25 vote: that the nature of Clinton’s pitch to young voters had more appeal to voters in their late 20s; that 25 is about the age at which Clinton nostalgia may still kick in; and that Obama had a stronger organization on campus, while Clinton had a better field operation in the cities where young adults are most likely to live.

There is implied in the first of these three “possible explanations” a flipside: there’s a starry-eyed idealist quality to Obama’s energizing message, and starry-eyed idealism is the traditional province of the young. The younger, the more so.

This idealism, and how we humans approach it, may account for the difference in pre-vote polling and actual polling as well.

In our most idealistic moments, we boast out loud of shaking up our lives and chucking up the dayjob to pursue our heart’s desire as a writer or musician or what-have-you, but in the cold light of the next dawn, trudge meekly off to work again. The devil’s in the uncertainty, and humans tend to choose the devil they know over the devil they don’t.

And so though many were inclned to rattle a pollster’s cage with an endorsement of the message of revolutionary change promised by Obama, once in the privacy of the voting booth, alone with their reservations and doubts, they betrayed the ideal– and pulled the lever for the devil they knew.

 

Comment by Donovan Fraser | 2008-01-11 12:20:18

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4115702&page=1

UPDATE!!!!!

looks like the Iranians didn’t send threatening messages toward our warships after all. our bad…. so sorry.

Gulf of Tonkin incident Averted…..

this part burns my ass…… knuckle dragging chimp Bush while in Israel goes on world wide TV threatening Iran over something he doesn’t even know is true.

What a disaster we have as POTUS. a real diplomat.

Comment by Kathleen | 2008-01-11 12:38:10

Cnn reports that the Iranians patrolling the Straits of Hormuz are the Iranian Revolutionary Guard. Ring a bell. Clinton and McCain voted yes on that amendment yes folks the Kyl Lieberman amendment turning these Iranian soldiers into “terrorist”

That means U.S. naval ships are patrolling in the Straits with what our congress defined as “terrorist” A disaster waiting to happen. The Neo-cons are not done yet.

That voice on the U.S. released tape does sound like a bad imitation of “Borat” and clearly this person has just learned to speak NEO-CONESE “WE are coming to get you, you will be blown up in a feeew minuuutes” Laughable if it were not so fucking potentially dangerous

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/11/29/iran.navy/

Iran’s Revolutionary Guards patrol Persian Gulf, U.S. says

Comment by Donovan Fraser | 2008-01-11 19:07:54

I love this part of the propaganda. whoever did the threatening message didn’t bother putting in the ambient noise that would be there( in REAL LIFE on a small boat on the high seas) no wind , no waves , no bumping around on a small boat sound,no seagulls, nothing. Perfectly quiet like you were inside a studio….I have a studio and i could make this shit up all day long .NO PROBLEM. digital studio’s allow ANYONE with a sliver of a brain to do anything sound wise and that doesn’t even take into account the newest technology of VOICE MORPHING that allows computers to hear 10 minutes of someone’s speech pattern and can from then on imitate it from then on. Maybe OBL is dead and his voice is computer generated? we wouldn’t be able to tell. Kinda freighting that now days you can’t believe what you hear or see. technology has passed overtaken our ethics.

Comment by Donovan Fraser | 2008-01-11 19:09:41

sorry about the last line. I meant to type ,technology has surpassed our ethics.

 

Comment by TeakwoodKite | 2008-01-11 19:27:42

What is really impressive is that since it was from the “government”, the MSM did not even question it’s authenticity. The MSM doesn’t care if they are lied to. It is Garbage in Garbage out. Suspension of disbelief?

 
 
 

Comment by Cee | 2008-01-11 16:25:10

Someone from the MEK or Mossad was on the shoreline with a megaphone. :D

 
 

Comment by Kathleen | 2008-01-11 13:02:05

Jane Hamsher at FDL’s latest on Edwards..go Jane

http://firedoglake.com/2008/01/11/stupidest-thing
-said-this-campaign-season/

 

Comment by justsomeone | 2008-01-11 13:03:23

Every time I think that “Universal Coverage” means passing a law that mandates everyone that can “afford” it is mandated to purchase it I laugh. Who decides what someone can afford??? Oh, I know that answer, Hillary. So if you’re already paying $400+ a month for your own barebones policy (& it’s going up every yr with no claims) you won’t mind paying an extra 2K mim a yr( that’s only $166 a mo in premiums, which will also keep going up) to help the millions that Hillary says can’t afford it. Forget it.

Comment by hoosierHoops | 2008-01-11 14:16:47

My Friend in the Netherlands has Universal Health care.. He pays 125 euro’s a month and every person by law must have it.. If you are unemployed they deduct it from your unemployment, which is a couple thousand euro’s a month, so really if you are out of work you still can survive ok..Not rich but you can get by till you find another job.
He say’s the system works pretty good for them.
We just need to revamp the whole mess we call health care and start all over and get it right.

 
 

Comment by CK | 2008-01-11 13:34:52

If one is healthy, one probably should forego Health Insurance.
http://www.theonion.com/content/node/29507 almost satire.

 

Comment by Fred C. Dobbs | 2008-01-11 15:47:16

So long as they/she can muster the resources and votes required for electoral success, I have no problem with female politicians and judging their relative merits objectively. Being the father of a woman who is an engineer and a career military officer may color my thinking somewhat, but there it is.

Still, one principle must always apply:

EQUAL RIGHTS MEANS EQUAL WRONGS!

Now, personally, I am tired of carrying all the load, so I am delighted for women to pick up some of the burden while I spend more time with Bonnevilles and Cutthroats, my rocking chair and a decent cigar on Sunday afternoons.

Women are not, in my opinion, likely to screw it up any worse than men have… and some fresh thinking just might improve our governance.

 

Comment by Sometime-CIA-Defender | 2008-01-11 16:00:08

*Sigh.* You’ve worn me down, Susan! If she actually holds up her end of this ten-point plan…

Hillary has proposed a comprehensive, 10-point plan to restore Americans’ confidence in their government by increasing transparency and cutting waste and corruption. Her plan includes:

Banning Cabinet officials from lobbying a Hillary Clinton administration.

Strengthening whistleblower protections.

Creating a public service academy.

Ending abuse of no-bid government contracts and posting all contracts online.

Cutting 500,000 government contractors.

Restoring the Office of Technology Assessment.

Publishing budgets for every government agency.

Implementing Results America Initiative to track government effectiveness.

Tracking and eliminating corporate welfare.

Expanding voting access and safeguarding voting machines.

…she’d be my hero.

Comment by Fred C. Dobbs | 2008-01-11 17:56:17

I’d settle for public flogging of Scooter Libby and the exhumation of the corpse allegedly previously-known as Ken Lay.

Comment by Sometime-CIA-Defender | 2008-01-11 22:40:52

I think I’d want a few more floggings (Gonzalez?), but I like the way you think.

 

Comment by TeakWoodKite | 2008-01-11 23:32:26

That untimely passing of the man who new to much, checked out proving you can’t take it with you.

http://www.aspenpitkin.com/uploads/autopsy%20lay.pdf

I will settle for a platoon of frog marching draft dodging law breaking traitors, marching to your favorite “I don’t know what I been told, that PDB was mafe of gold!”

 
 
 

Comment by S. Markom | 2008-01-12 07:34:26

Is that the same Sidney Blumenthal that was just arrested for Driving Drunk?

 

Pingback by This Racism Kerfuffle Is Total B.S. : NO QUARTER | 2008-01-12 13:28:43

[…] booth. TNR buries this excuse-making in a new piece, “Poll Potheads.” As did I in pointing to stats on the number of young women and independents who voted for […]

 

Comment by wethornet | 2008-01-12 15:32:22

larry reports that there are technical difficulties with nq. this is the most current thread.

SHIRIN, I APOLOGIZE.

i would hope after all this time, with my many posts on nq, you had a better handle on me.

i’m not going to go into it on the wrong thread, more when we get back on line. and after the football games.

shirin, note my timeline. at 0523 i posted. at 0530 i had corrected my mistake.

(i had written “here at osamasucks.com” when i meant obamasucks.com.)

i’m going to watch sports. the first rule of when you’re in a hole is to stop digging. :-(

 

Comment by lester | 2008-01-13 11:58:36

Isn’t larry johnson of the “realist” school of foreign policy”? why would he back an interventionist liberal, which would appear to be the polar opposite of his own belief system?

 

Comment by Fred C. Dobbs | 2008-01-13 20:27:58

YOUR HILLARY CLINTON JOKE

Sometime in the Spring of 1996, Bill and Hillary
“slipped the chain” of Secret Service watchfulness, donned big sunglasses and baseball caps, rented a Chrysler Sebring convertible and took a Road Trip from DC to her family home in Wheaton, IL.

On the outskirts of Wheaton they needed fuel and pulled into a local service station. One with a real, live Attendant.

After putting the nozzle in the tank, the Attendant loks at them and says, “Well, Hillary Rodham, long time no see! How ya been?”

To Bubba’s amazement, she replies, “Real good Wally. And yourself?”

A few desultory exchanges occur and, as Wally walks to remove the nozzle Bubba asks: “Where do you know that guy from?”

She says, “I went to high school with Wally. In fact, he took me to my Senior Prom.”

Bill considers that for a moment and replies: “Well, you’re doing REAL good, aren’t you? He’s working in a gas station and you’re married to the President of the United States!”

She pokes a finger into the Presidential breastbone and informs him:

“Listen, Cracker. If I’d married HIM, HE’D be President of the United States!!!”

 

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