A Family Fight or a License to Hate?
By Joanne Parrent on April 29, 2008 at 11:05 PM in Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Iraq, John McCain, Women and Children, Women's Suffrage
So, Democrats, the media tells us we are in the midst of a “family fight.”
To introduce myself and my family, I am a latte-drinking, white, college-educated progressive Democrat who, despite my demographic, supports Hillary Clinton. Maybe it is because I am also a woman over 45. My mother and my late father are “blue collar” Democrats. My Dad worked in a factory in the Detroit area all his life and my mother, in a medical supply house. My mother, whose vote doesn’t count – for now at least – because she lives in Michigan, supports Hillary.
My younger sister, another educated progressive Democrat, (who, oddly, thinks Starbucks coffee is too bitter and doesn’t drink lattes), voted for Obama. We had several “family fights” about this, mostly by email since I live in the great Hillary-supporting state of California and my sister lives in Maryland, an Obama stronghold.
It occurs to me that my “family fight” somewhat mirrors the Democratic primary that the media has frequently characterized as a “family fight.” Therefore, I thought Democrats, particularly those latte (or non-latte) drinking, educated, progressive, blog-reading Democrats in the upcoming primaries, would like to hear about my family fight and what I learned from it, in the hope that it could illuminate the larger battle.
When I asked my sister why she didn’t want to vote for the first viable female candidate for President – and a brilliant person as well – she told me that she “hates” Hillary Clinton. Stunned at the intensity of her feelings, I asked her “Why?” She proceeded to give me some reasons that I found startlingly similar to the Obama campaign talking points:
- Sister:
Hillary voted for the war in Iraq.
Me: Actually, she voted to give the President the authorization to go to war so the threat of war would force Saddam Hussein to allow UN inspectors back into Iraq, which it did. Bush, not Hillary, then decided to stop those inspections before they were done and invade Iraq. (I sent her an article in the Huffington Post by anti-war activist, former Ambassador and husband of Valerie Plame, Joe Wilson, about this. Joseph Wilson, Huffington Post)
Sister: I don’t have time for this. She still voted for the war, and Obama was against the war.
Me: Obama didn’t have to make that tough decision. He wasn’t in the Senate. He wasn’t representing the state of New York that had been devastated on 9/11. He just gave a speech at an anti-war rally in Chicago, in his very safe, very liberal State Senate District. How much courage did that take?
Sister: Look, I’m inspired by Obama. Democrats have the right to be inspired too, you know.
Me: Okay, you like the guy. I am not crazy about him, myself. He seems like a snake oil salesman, selling hope and change. But I don’t “hate” him, and you still haven’t answered my question about why you “hate” Hillary.
- Sister: Hillary is just like Bill Clinton. She’s too moderate and they both “triangulate”. We don’t need another Clinton. I’m tired of Bushes and Clintons. We need something new. (To her credit she didn’t use the epithet “Billary” which may have been too sexist for her. Or she may have just been embarrassed to say that to me.)
Me: Have you seen Hillary’s policy proposals? They are very similar to Obama’s. In some cases, particularly her health care proposal, they are more progressive than his. (I sent her one of economist Paul Krugman’s articles from the New York Times on why Hillary’s health care plan which will cover everyone is better than Obama’s, which will only cover children. )
Sister: Who has time to read all of these things? Politicians never do them anyway. He inspires people. That’s what we need in a President. I’m going to lose my job if you don’t quit writing all these emails and sending me all these articles.
Me: I am just trying to find out why you “hate” Hillary so much?
- Sister:
Hillary Clinton will do anything to get elected. She’s running a negative
campaign.
Me: Can’t you see that that is just code for she’s an ambitious, ball-busting bitch?! What kind of sexist double standard is that? Hillary has paid her dues. She didn’t run for President in 2004 after only four years in the Senate. She waited until 2008 after being elected by the state of New York with a huge majority to a second term.
Yet, Obama’s ambition is very apparent. He has run for higher office every three years. He is impatient to get to the highest office in the land. And, do you really think Obama won’t do anything to get elected? Both he and his campaign have been very negative. He or his campaign spokespeople have said she:
- is a “calculating, poll-tested, divisive figure”
- "consistently" and "deliberately" misleads the American people.
- is “dishonest”
- is attempting to "deceive the American people".
- is "one of the most secretive politicians in America".
- is "a monster".
- is "not being straight with the American people".
They have also claimed that:
- “The American people are not going to elect a president that they do not trust".
- And, (probably the worse), they have said that John McCain is seen as more honest and trustworthy than Hillary Clinton.
Obama is a master at the very negative campaigning that he and his campaign accuse Hillary of practicing. And, though he calls her a liar, he has lied plenty in this campaign. (I sent her a New York Times news article about how he lied about a Senate bill that he claimed to have passed but didn’t regarding radioactive leaks at nuclear power plants. New York Times)
Sister: Quit sending me these emails! Can’t we just agree to disagree? I’ll vote for her if she is nominated. But, I don’t want to talk about it anymore.
That, sadly, was the end of our conversation. But from it and others with Obama supporters, as well as listening to the regular anti-Hillary rants on the “progressive” Air America talk radio, I realized something quite disturbing.
I realized that a very important pillar of Obama’s campaign strategy is exploiting the irrational hatred of Hillary Clinton. This hatred was first brought to us by the Republicans, and it is now the rallying cry of Obama supporters. The negative things Obama and his campaign have been saying about Hillary are 50 times worse on the blogosphere and the progressive talk stations (she’s a “bitch”, a “f**king whore”, “Billary”, “warmongering” etc.) than even that coming directly from him and his campaign. But the license to do this, the license to spew negative and vile, often misogynistic hatred, has come from Obama and his campaign – if they can call her a divisive liar, why can’t talk-show host Randi Rhodes go a little farther and call her a whore?
The other strategic pillars of his campaign are 1) his ability to give inspiring speeches about change and hope, 2) his race, which legitimately brings pride to African Americans and makes white liberals feel good about their support for the first viable African American nominee and 3) his hip, trendy, youthful coolness. None of these, in my opinion, are the best reasons to choose a President who will have the responsibility for pulling us out of war, an economic mess, a climate crisis and various other difficult, explosive foreign policy problems. But they aren’t ugly.
The exploitation and encouragement of Hillary-hating by the Obama campaign, however, is ugly. And, it is insulting not only to Hillary but to all women and particularly those who have worked hard and competed in male-dominated professions – like politics.
What is astonishing about what the Obama campaign has accomplished is that it has built so much of its support on this sexist, negative and inaccurate portrayal of Hillary Clinton, while at the same time successfully spreading the myth that it is the Clinton campaign that is negative. And the Obama campaign couldn’t have done this without the willing participation of Obama, himself, which belies the claim that he is a “unifying” figure and that he practices “new politics”, let alone that he brings people together. In fact, he is bringing people to his campaign by scapegoating and demonizing the “other” – the old, traditional, divisive, bitchy, lying, politics-as-usual Hillary Clinton.
Yet, in reality, Hillary is not only not traditional: she is, in fact, a very unusual figure in American politics – a First Lady who became a Senator and then ran for President. How many of those have we had? She also is not only not divisive but she has shown, as a Senator, that she can work with people who hated her and her husband when he was President.
She has healed relationships that one would expect could never be healed.
Women across the country are working their hearts out for Hillary, not only because they want to see this brilliant woman become the first woman President, but because they are furious at the ugly misogyny coming from the Obama camp.
And they know that the Obama campaign could not have been successful in building their support on the demonization of Hillary without the willing cooperation of a male-dominated, sexist media. A media that rarely reports that his campaign is regularly calling her some of the worst epithets ever thrown at one Democrat by another, but one that pounces on her when she or her surrogates even mildly criticize him. A media that doesn’t even notice that he is a Democrat, who, in attempting to tear her down, actually tears down the administration of the one Democrat since FDR, Bill Clinton, who has won two terms of office. (In his “bitter”/”clinging” remarks, Obama stated that the Clinton years were as bad for working people as the Bush years.)
I couldn’t talk to my sister about all of this because she wouldn’t listen. But, I’m hoping that voters in the upcoming primaries will listen. I’m hoping that Democrats, particularly those latte-drinking college educated Obama-leaning people will educate themselves to what is really going on in this primary election. I’m hoping that not just women, but men with daughters, mothers, wives and sisters, men who respect women –will no longer be inspired by hatred.
I’m hoping that this Democratic “family” will not stand by and watch as Obama and his campaign tear down Hillary Clinton and get away with it in the media, if not in the hearts half of the primary voters so far.
There is no question that this primary campaign has alienated a lot of women. And women are this party’s biggest block of supporters—almost 60 percent of reliable Democratic voters. If we abandon so many women, the backbone of our party, by nominating Obama, it will be more than a family fight.
It will be a very bad time for the Democratic family – without the scores of women in local offices to answer the phones, canvass and run the ground game. We won’t have much of a family with women walking out of the house in droves.
We need these hard-working reliable “mamas” – and Hillary Clinton – much more than we need a candidate who has given his followers a license to hate – Barack Obama.
i agree - there’s a lot of hate in that Hope™.
Wow–that’s deja vu all over again. I’ve had the same conversation with my best friend of 35 years who’s an Obama supporter. And I’m a latte drinking/wine track white woman and I have an ivy league phd and I will ONLY vote for Hilary. But I am over 45.
Frankly, I cannot understand why anyone is for Obama and not for Hillary, but it’s especially shocking to me that women over….12 would be?
I avoid my friends who are Obama supporters. I just don’t like them right now.
Is there mind control going on? I, too, have had this discussion. I have lost respect for several people that I thought were much more objective and rational than they are. I do know a couple of Obama supporters with whom I can have a rational discussion. We just have different judgments about how the American people will react to him in the GE, but this is not irrational or hate-based. I am betting that enough people will change their mind about Hillary once the really get to hear her, and my friends are betting that they won’t and that they will not be swayed by the right wing propaganda machine this time around.
Forgot to add that the person with whom I am most disgusted is my highly educated brother-in-law. He graduated first in his elite high school class with near-perfect SAT scores, did well in law school yet he is one of the worst offenders. My husband keeps responding to his Hillary-hating emails with requests for him to back up his assertions with facts and he almost never can. He no longer brings up the race with my husband because he knows he hasn’t a leg to stand on. The final blow came when my husband told him that not all men have a problem supporting strong, intelligent women. My husband has copied the emails to his sisters - who are not particularly political and seem to be on the fence - and they have been cheering him on. I think they are tired of seeing this guy put on a pedestal for his supposed brilliance. It’s been kind of funny, but also pathetic to see someone with his intellectual gifts be so shallow and irrational in his decision making.
Yes I don’t either and I don’t know if I will get “over it”. This is the most important election in our lifetimes and perhaps since FDR, and I can’t see how anyone can vote for the pretender.
Joanne—Thanks for taking the time to tell us your story. I know it must hurt to go through all of this, because often the Hillary haters make us feel like they hate us, too. And since this is the first time a woman actually has a chance of becoming President, this campaign has become an extremely personal one for so many of us.
Thank you, Joanne, for your eloquent words. I am copying and pasting your mindful responses to the “Hillary-hater” in your family, so that I may use them in the future to help my “debates” with the “Hillary-haters” whom I meet in my travels. Kudos to you!
Unity, right there.
And she didn’t say a thing, did she?
Clinton is so divisive that she got at least a little respect from R. M. Scaife. (Call the Pope; that has to qualify as a miracle.)
And that is used against her- Air Obama constantly reminds it’s listeners that Scaife respects her to suggest that she’s not really a liberal.
Meanwhile, they celebrate the fact that Obama has drawn Republican votes in open primaries as “proof” that he can win in November and would be a “healing” president. Go figure.
This was beautifully done! And Right On!
Echos of so many conversations I’ve had, campaign calls I’ve made.
I hope we don’t blow it. The whole country has an opportunity to have a strong, compassionate, courageous, brilliant leader in these desperate times. I’m so proud that our best choice happens to be a women, though I am far from surprised. And as sad as I am that so many Americans are lining up to buy the snake oil, as you put it, I am forever grateful to have had the chance to support HRC for president.
Now, back to work. Make Calls, donate, send emails.
Wow! What a fantastic post. I’m sure to follow your posts from now on!
I’m avoiding talking to my Obama supporting friends. I have one friend (who is under 40 but grew up in a household that went on public assistance for a while) and is a Hillary voter. We talk a bit about the election, but not much.
I think a lot of women “hate” Hillary because she reminds them of the bullshit and games and triangulation we all need to do to manage in this world. It’s galling.
This 42 year old white collar professional, creative class woman with a blue/pink-collar family and an advanced degree in the hardest of hard sciences would crawl on her knees over broken glass to vote for Hillary Clinton. It’s fucking DISGUSTING to me that the split second the best and most qualified and experienced candidate in the universe is a woman, people suddenly start whining and mewling about how “oh experience isn’t everything.” Piss off.
LOL! Now you are someone I would like to have coffee with.
How about the MSM women? Do you think some of the Hillary “hate” from them could be out of envy and jealousy? I think there could be secret admirers in the MSM women and they don’t even realize it.
People will get over their “hate” when they have health care, we are out of Iraq and gas prices go down and we are on a path to self reliance on energy created by the jobs from the new energy economy Hillary will create. It pains me that people “liked” Bush and look what he has done! So maybe it’s a good sign people “hate” Hillary. Fine. But she will work for the people that “hate” her anyway because she has the guts, skills and will forgive her former political “enemies” as she has always done and get things badly needed done.
I am amazed how petty and self centered some people are and miss the big picture en total: this election is about picking the best leader. It is not a beauty contest. Obama can go away now and model for GQ.
So everyone should tell their family members, colleagues and friends it is OK to “hate” Hillary. She does not mind and will work her butt off for them anyway and get the job done for America.
Yeah, I’ve noticed how many women in the MSM have it out for Hillary. The ONLY talk-radio woman that I have heard go to bat for Hillary is Lynn Samuels, and I say kudos to her for that! But the rest of the women have been decidedly cool toward Hillary.
It particularly crawled all over me to see Arianna Huffington going after Hillary Clinton with such vengence on Bill Maher’s show–particularly when she used to be part of the “vast right-wing conspiracy” at one time. Even Maher, an admitted Obama supporter, is not so dismissive of Hillary Clinton as Arianna is. It did crack me up when Maher made that comment “At least, my husband wasn’t gay”, which obviously referred to Arianna’s own sham marriage to Michael Huffington.
Speaking of sham marriages: Obama and his young wannabe leftists. They are so full of hope for change they don’t see the empty suit who has aligned himself with the corporations. They also don’t see someone branded as liberal has no chance in the GE, and McCain will brand him as a liberal. That’s a much harder argument to sustain against Hillary as her actual behavior (not the spin about her) is that she is a centrist. 527’s aside, Hillary and McCain will have to debate issues and experience.
Yes, indeed! In as much as Hillary has pissed me off by some of her “centrist” positions (e.g., signing on to that egregious anti-flag burning amendment, concern over violence in videogames, etc.), I recognized a good while ago that she was positioning herself for broader appeal. And she has actually succeeded pretty well on that count, regardless of what the MSM say. At least, that’s what I hear from some of my Republican friends and family–from people who used to bash Hillary unmercifully and now, look at her as the best qualified of the bunch (including McBush!).
The thing that hacks me is how much power the MSM has in molding public opinion. Elizabeth Edwards had a very nice op-ed in the New York Times yesterday, and she pointed out how the MSM had virtually shut out Joe Biden and Chris Dodd from much coverage and how the SAME MSM had hyped Fred Thompson to the point where he was running second before even declaring his candidacy!
When one recognizes that the MSM is controlled by corporate interests, then it becomes clear why certain candidates garnered all the attention while the ONLY coverage that other candidates got was of a negative nature (e.g., Joe Biden as gaffe machine, the break-in at Chris Dodd’s headquarters, etc.). In short, it’s little wonder why Obama has gotten such a “free ride” from the media–corporate interests figure that he’s the most easily manipulated if he manages to make it into the White House. Similarly, he’s the weakest candidate for the GE so they really have their bets covered.
Last week I was having a monthly dinner with a group of women friends who all support Hillary except one.
The person who is for Obama started complaining that
Hillary was so negative and nasty to Obama. Soon I found some of the Hillary supporters agreeing and the others just being quiet and found myself in much the situation you were with your sister -only one against three. I wasn’t surprised by the Obama supporter but it shocked me to find the Hillary supporters beginning to believe what they were hearing about Hillary from the Obama campaign and MSM sound bites. We all left dinner in a less than cordial way and didn’t set next months date. I do worry about how we will heal all these “family”
squabbles when this is over. Thanks for this great article and moral support. The “devil” just might make me send this to the Hillary supporters in my group.
Basically what they are seeing is she has bigger cajones than he does. And let’s face it, she does. She all those things a wimpy guy wishes he could be.
Love the sentiment of this post, but Kopechne’s “I just don’t like them right now,” has made my night.
You know, there is every opportunity to respect others, play by the rules, civilization is necessary to survive and thrive, and someones need to disrupt does not in anyway override our right to exist peacefully.
I mean, who the hell are they?
Having said that, as long as mutual respect and adult behavior is truly exhibited, everyone CAN progress.
But the minute any Obamabot tries the dirty tricks, well, they better make sure they understand what they’re getting into.
It’s been my expericene they don’t have a fucking clue.
None.
And when K&& is what passes for enlightened intellectualism in your group, well, you know…
Great post….What I found interesting is the reluctance of the sister to READ any of the policies about either candidate….A reluctance to research the history of candidates, parties, or electoral machinations…
This is very disturbing…..I’m a Clinton supporter because I read about all the candidates….
I think quite a few obama supporters, especially younger ones, are supporting him based on emotions and actual policies and abilities don’t seem to matter. He Moves them and that’s pretty much all they need. Deval Patrick was like that and he won handily. Unfortunately Mass people don’t think he’s such a hot deal now. That’s why all the Kennedys and Kerrys in the world could endorse barack and they weren’t going to help him win. They recognized Deval Patrick again and rejected it. So basically, what we have here is a guy who invokes emotions. That’s why her sister didn’t want to hear about those silly policy details.
And that’s why adults don’t let children pick presidents in the end.
Well Uppity….I also am saddened that so many children are misled. I did’nt try to sway my daughter but tried to teach her what I was taught.
I was taught that it was shameful to neglect the responsibility of being an INFORMED VOTER. Me daughter at 10 was watching the debates between Gore and Bush and followed the entire campaign. Civics begins at home.
Is this a car commercial for Honda?
LOL….no.
I do believe in the socratic method of examination and despite his onion breath Diogenes is one of my daughters heroes…..
I don’t anticipate my daughter ever belonging to a cult.
Except we are Catholic so I guess we belong to THE WHORE OF BABYLON cult…chuckle..
Joanne, GOOD JOB!
This quote stands out:
“I realized that a very important pillar of Obama’s campaign strategy is exploiting the irrational hatred of Hillary Clinton.“
I figured this out several months back. After I had, I could no longer tolerate the offensive, vulgar, misogynistic attacks especially when I was planning to tow the Party line if Obama was the nominee. Not now! Obama will have to WIN WITHOUT ME!
This irrational Hillary hatred has infected even the Party leadership. That professional politicians are behaving this way has caused me to leave the Party. I want no more of their adolescent crap. They allowed the degradation of the only 2 term Democratic President that we’ve had in like what 50 years?
The Obama supporters have threatened violence, rioting if he doesn’t get the nomination. And yet Obama had the audacity to caution NYC AAs about not resorting to violence after the Sean Bell verdict.
Excuse me, but 50 shots that kill an unarmed man, yet nothing about the the threats of violence in Denver? Oh I guess violence is all right if it helps you get the nomination. I was already beyond the final straw, I mention this to point out how absolutely inspiring Obama is. Why hasn’t he commented on the constant threats of violence in Denver? On Tavis Smiley? Mayor Nutter? Even Hillary.
This whole Primary has been more surreal than anything that Fellini could have put in movie.
Tell your sister that Hillary inspires me, Obama doesn’t. Then have her Google Obama’s List of Lies. That should inspire her!
I think people need to check into Donna Brazile’s relationship with Karl Rove a bit more. I was weary of this stench early on in this campaign. As a black man, it is truly hard to deal with my own family. I’ve been called a sellout and an oreo. I refrained from calling my brother and sister both stupid mf’s though:) AA’s don’t realize that they have added their votes to those of mostly ex-repubs.
They are the new freepers and don’t know it! I stand with Hillary even for their benefit.
Thank you so much for this post. I am sending it to my daughter who has her hands full raising kids and babysitting others. She has been open to listening to me when she has a few moments of time to focus on our conversation, but her BF is a staunch Obama supporter.
She and her friends have resorted to steering the conversation off to other subjects in his presence because he goes off the wall just as many of the others tend to do. She and her friends are all pre-occupied with the demands of taking care of their children day-to-day, but the noise is still there in the background of their lives.
Your article here gives me an articulate, quiet, and soft way to counter that noise. Hopefully she’ll share it with her friends, too. I’m certainly encouraging her to do so.
But it is that very shrill, unhinged hatred towards Hillary that turned me off to Obama. Perhaps you could point that out to those folks sitting on the fence. It is disturbing to say the least.
Yes, it has turned my daughter and her friends off, too. However, due to the day to day demands of taking care of their families, they haven’t really had the time and opportunity, or at least they don’t feel they do, to get up and keep up to speed on all of it.
This provided me with excellent points articulated very well that she can share with her friends.
For me this was exemplified by that look on Obama’s face and the tone of his voice in that debate when he said to her ” YOUR LIKABLE ENOUGH”
He lost me for good then. I thought….You sir are ill mannered and arrogant and your momma would be ashamed of your behavior….If he had been my son I would have climbed up on that stage and verbally dressed him down…..
Obama has terrorist connections, the more that comes out about Rezko, and Auchi, and the corruption in the state of IL, (my goodness, Rezko was a part of the “let’s fire Fitzgerald” consortium), the harder it will be to deny Obama’s cynical manipulations of his “base.”
Now see this is the kind of crap that is making so many Americans turn against Obama:
That, from the cesspool at Huffpo, in their current article about Hillary and the O’Reilly show. Nothing could be further from the truth. It is as if I, an educated woman who has done very well in her life is somehow supposed to support Obama because these left cliffers say so. If not, then I must be all those other things. This is the kind of thing that has PISSED off every educated professional woman I know. It is Obama’s moronic sycophants who make assinine remarks such as this, who have hurt him most. In the end they will all go down with him for their arrogant assumption that only they educated, important or doing well in life. That attitude is projected DIRECTLY upon Obama. These people are truly assholes. Half of these people are sucking dry their parents’ retirement money to appear “upscale”.
Good for you. The sad thing is that most women are the worst offenders. They hated sen. Hillary Clinton, but couldn’t tell you why. It is sad.
I never could understand the women that hate her so much either. Or that any woman would not be outraged by the rampant misogyny directed at Hillary Clinton.
I am now in the process of reading Phyllis Chesler’s book “woman’s inhumanity to woman” and it is explaining a lot of things and making me very sad.
This is a fantastic article. My brother is so bad that I’ve stopped trying to talk to him. All he says (screams) is “Billary…. can’t win because everyone hates her.” Who hates her?! Why do they hate her?! Misogyny, as Joanne so eloquently labels it, is the reason pure and simple. Meanwhile, too many Hillary supporters are so afraid of being called racists that they dare not even say they’re for her, because, for many valid reasons, they don’t think Obama can beat McCain or be as good a president as Hillary.
Ah but in the voting booth all the people that are afraid to say they support Hillary will put this puppy to bed.
I guess the Obama camp that does not mind using the race card forgot what happens when you put a people down: they rise up!
How true….Guitarist….
Fallaces sunt rerum species….
Translation : The appearance of things are deceptive….
I tend to be guttural in my prose but do like the more eloquent way you put that! I’ll stick with the puppy references and such though, as that’s who I am.
Well….perhaps since all empires turn to dust I occsionally like to brush up my very rusty latin….I appreciate you indulgence.
Hey I like the Latin.
And I wish I could play guitar….Tis’ a secret envy….
Well you better switch sides to Obama! He can hope you some guitar playing abilities by waving his magic wand!
LOL….I have a POPE for that….thanks…..
The sad part of the Obama campaign is the anti-Clinton sentiments of a majority of his supporters.
Thanks for the excellent essay.
Great post! Each time the DNC e-mails me for money, I respond with some of these points and send a contribution to Hillary.
Me, too. I return their email with a statement that I will donate just as soon as Florida and Michigan have their vote.
Have you received the obama news letter or emails? they sent attack emails to their supporters all the time. it is no suprised to me that your sister or obama supporters got duped into the negative stuff.
They have been attacking Hillary for taking lobbyist money, NAFTA lies etc…then you have cable news constantly ripping Hillary for being negative.
I am done with obama and his supporters.
Joanne, politicans & campaigns come & go, not so with kid sisters, little sisters are forever.
heck i sent to a friend the post here about that Jayz stuff and i was called a racist by a friend..theni had to point out to her..that both my husband and son are doulbe minorities and me being a racist would be news to them!
I will say this as i have before..i worked as a volunteer for Edwards in two states..on my own dime..i flew from Fla to Iowa and froze my butt off..and gave up the Xmas and New Years holidays..with my family..and i was crushed when Edwards supended his campaign, right after i was in South Carolina for him..and i stood inches from his podium for hsi concession speech..and he shook my hand and was so gracious that i was there helping out.
I never would have thought i would be now cheering for Hillary..but i am and 100% because of what i have seen of the Obama behaviour..both the cheating that went on in Iowa that i saw with my own eyes and the bullshit i saw in South Carolina by the Obamabrats.
They remind me exactly like the bush sheeple after 2000 and after 9/11..i would bet the farm many are being paid to propel their propaganda..and bullsh!t..
I can no longer tolerate any of them.
There is no such thing as unity with team Obama..they are nothing but a bunch of out of control thugs.
There is no reasoning with them so i don’t bother.
I say what i have to say and move on.
They are like a cult..the same cult bush came from.
There is little to no difference.
I feel sad for my country..what i did see as unity in 2004 ..is now nothing but a dream.
I will neither work, nor spend a dime supporting this fraud, and cheater, and his band of Ipod kids and thugs.
I want nothing to do with this or have my name or integrity tied to this creep.
fly
Hey Flyarm, well said.
At some point some enterprising psych student will figure out the Obama blogs will be like other “monologues” and worth a thesis, perhaps similar to Michelle Obamas.
Great post. There is a lot of CDS going around. But that epidemic has peaked and luckly for them the Clinton health care plan covers pre-existing conditions.
I have done a survey of comments on the Rev Wright fallout on newspaper blogs thinking them more objective than say our own and certainly more objective and saner than TPM, Huff Post and Daily Kos.
Here are the stories:
LA Times and Charlotte Observer blogs
NY Times blog
Divorce your sister. She sounds very lazy — too lazy to read — too lazy to investigate and compare. She (and my sister-in-law) are examples of why some people shouldn’t be allowed to vote. They are too lazy to take the time to study the issues, investigate the person and make INFORMED decisions.
It’s amazing to me how many people fall for the snObama reinvention of history. He’s a con man — and yet even smart folk fall for his con.
So many democrats have fallen for the GOP character assassination of the Clintons during the 1990s and even recently. The idiot Obamabots at the caucus I was forced to endure were spouting off pure anti Clinton progaganda — from the GOP “right wing conspiracy” play book. They of course could NOT name a single thing that snObama was FOR — or any of his accomplishment — but they did have the full course of the lies, spears and b.s. about Senator Clinton. One kid was so young — he was probably too young to vote. He was shaking in rage when he spoke about Hillary Clinton — that image will stay with me for a long time.
Obama has cause a great deal of harm to families and to the democratic party — because he is NOT a true democrat. Axlerod & Obama have been using the GOP play book — to the shock of some of the GOP pundits. I think some of the GOP talking heads are getting a mirror view of what they look like when they rant uncontrollably against anything democratic.
I don’t know if I’ll ever be able to have a civil conversation with my sister in law. She’s probably unaware that Obama hates her and all older women.
My mother-in-law is just like your sister-in-law. She hates Hillary because she’s “sneaky, manipulative, dishonest, etc.” but can’t name anything she’s done that’s particularly sneaky, manipulative, dishonest, etc., she totally fell for the GOP character assassination of the Clintons during the ’90s. At her birthday party, she tried to goad me into a discussion and got frustrated when I wouldn’t take the bait. As someone mentioned earlier, it’s sad to see women being misogynistic toward other women (and ultimately themselves).
AND my mother-in-law has had a longtime crush on Keith Olbermann…and we know how HE feels about Hillary.
What amazes me about the whole obamazoid campaign is how very naziesgue it is. Accuse your opponent of planning to do or doing EXACTLY what YOU have been doing all along. Play on irrational hatreds and fears. When that dosen’t work use aggressive intimidation,anybody seen the clips of the obamazoids at the caucuses? And let’s not forget outright thuggery, like not only threatening the life of a broadcaster(Tavis Smiley) but his elderly MOTHER because he DARES ask questions about your guy. Oh yeah, there are those FIRES and SHOOTINGS at Hillary headquarters too. Then to put a cherry on top of the shit sunday that is the obamalamadingdong campaign, we have the Rev. NawNawNaw Wright and obamalamadingdong after 20 FARKIN YEARS coming out of his comma and realizing this huckster is a raving racist and hates America. In a way it has been a relief to have experianced this campaign. It has enabled me to finally tell a fair amount of people who I have marginally tolerated because they were on my “side” to fuck off once and for all. I mean really, haven’t there been people who claim to be liberals or Dems who you just CRING when ever they open their mouths? Dollar to a box of doughnut holes they upport the obama.
My family shows the opposite trend than that of the national statistics. The least educated are ga-ga over “We are the one’s we’ve been waiting for”, and don’t care about policy comparisons, but focus on one issue - she voted for the war and he did not (ignoring the details of how he did not have an opportunity to vote and said to Tim Russert that he did not know how he would have voted had he been in the Senate.) My college-age child and I are turned off by slogans such as, “We are the ones we have been waiting for!” I’d like to see a better analysis of those stats on education level of voters.
Hmmmm………I think that our national dependence on polls is a disaster.
I don’t quite fit the national ID polls either. I’m working class and College (ivy league) edumicated. I’m too Po’ to drink lattes although I would if I could. I am a middle aged CRACKER FEMALE but I wasn’t really very bitter until I was told I was in PA. Could be because I’m Catholic. ( chuckle )
What dismays me is that after 8 years in this regime of thievery and stupidity we are poised to commit the same crime of idiocy again. I was so tired of the vindictive and hypocritical treatment of both Clintons in the 90’s. I have watched my party spiral into cowardice and confusion. I have watched the opposition party dervish into HOMOPHOBIC HOLYROLLERS. Who have no care what so ever for balancing a federal budget. In the old tradition being a fiscal conservative or a liberal were both noble positions.
My grandad was a conservative but he also supported civil rights nd thought there should be balance in federal programs because he felt that too much welfare could be dangerous to a national work ethic. My grandmother was an FDR progressive, but was also a strong proponent for the military and the truman doctrine as a protection of US interests. Each had one thing in common….THEY BOTH HATED ST. REAGAN AND THOUGHT HE WAS A FOOL. In todays politics there seems to be more extremism than ever and our elected officials are more negligent than ever of their responsibility to inform and compromise. The income gap has become alarming. The war is draining the nation. We need a strong leader but we have to be VERY CAREFUL about the strength of that leader. We were very LUCKY in the leadership of FDR. Britain was very lucky wth Churchill. While the rest of the world turned to FASCISM we had leaders that resisted it. When I look at this election, I see that the stakes are high.
I don’t see leadership coming forth from Obama’s campaign which seems to egg on his supporters and the msm in the dirty 19t c. style politics of win at all costs. I see the oppositin candidate who seems to have compromised every scruple he has to obtain his party’s nomintion. And I se one canidate who has demonstrated through word and action the capability to serve. I was initially excited by the candidacy of Obama, what democrat wasn’t, but I have been chastened and now I alarmed. To me Clinton is the choice that makes sense. The only way to unite this party and get back to the proper business of running the country is the centrist path.It is the only remey to the extremism of both the LEFT AND THE RIGHT.
We do need a Centrist Party. IMHO, it’s just responsible government…taking care of all things that matter to the majority of people.
I’ve had so many conversations- online and in person- with people just like your sister. The same phrases and words come up all the time- she’s “too moderate,” she “voted for the war and he didnt”, he’s “inspiring,” she “triangulates..”
You see this stuff bleated on Taegan Goddard’s site, HuffPo, MoveOn, etc.- and if you challenge it, you get angry responses because it’s clear that they don’t know how to deal with people who don’t just agree with the talking point.
And these people wonder why we call them Obamabots, Zombies, Cultists, etc. We call them things like this because they are acting like irrational, hypnotized sheep. They don’t want to listen to arguments, they want to indoctrinate the unconvinced. If they can’t do that, they want to shout them down. And they get VERY angry if you question their devotion.
And the level of hate toward Hillary is just bizarre. HATE a candidate because she’s a “moderate?” Because she “triangulates” (while at the same time claiming that Obama can “reach out across the aisle and break down the partisanship in Washington?”) Because she “voted for the war” ( not even true?) These people INVENT reasons to hate Hillary as easily as they invent reasons to love Obama. I just don’t get it, but it sickens me.
My college-age child was skeptical when I said that I had seen many claims that Clinton is “a liar” without mention of supporting evidence. He later told me that he sat next to a man in a train station, and when asked by the man whether he had voted in our primary, my child said he had voted for Clinton. The man apparently went into a rage and said Clinton was a liar. My child asked him, specifically, what lies he was referring to, and told me that the man had no answer.
Have had some of the same conversations with family and friends.
Family will probably be forgiven in time, except for the granddaughter that called me a “racist”. Having been raised in this liberal family she knows what an insult that was and thus is no longer welcome in my home.
Friends that spout Obama talking points are no longer friends. I have lived too long and seen too much to waste what little time I have left on such hateful fools.
Words do matter to me and when someone calls me a racist they are off my Christmas Card List forevah!
Obama opened a can of worms and maybe a can of whipass on himself….
http://www.suntimes.com/news/mitchell/923055,CST-NWS-mitch30.article
That’s an interesting article, did Barry just throw the black community under the bus too? She sure thinks so.
That is an interesting article. I find it sad that the writer feels that Wright is a warrior who soldiers on for the cause. Does she feel the KKK cause is justified…. Wright represents a racial supremacy. I thought the whole point of the civil rights movement was to END RACIAL SUPREMACY AND DESCRIMINATION AGAINST ALL MINORITIES BASED ON RACE…RELIGION..GENDER…SEXUAL PREFERENCE…PHYSICAL OR MENTAL DISABILITY….CLASS…INCOME…AGE…
In Wright’s world where do I belong…..
I don’t the think the article is saying that. The article is saying that the black church has been a longstanding sanctuary for the AA community. Like it or not, many AAs feel disenfranchised, alienated from mainstream society. They feel racism on a visceral level. You’d be surprised how many AAs believe that AIDS conspiracy stuff. Maybe AAs don’t go around spouting it off, but everytime we are confronted with the tones of racism and how hard our lives continue to be, there are pangs of doubt on all levels.
Ministers of the black church often speak to these feelings, perhaps not to the degree that Wright does, some maybe worse, if that’s possible, but it is. The thing that whites must remember is that there are hundreds of black churches in any given community. Some are tiny, some huge. All Obama and Wright has done is put the black church in an unfavorable spotlight. But we all know there are a lot of churches with nutjobs of all races as ministers.
Obama threw the black community under the bus long ago. When he encouraged the unwavering support without addressing any issues as he tried to run a campaign that transcended race.
It would have been much wiser for Obama and the AA community to have been honest with each other instead of entering into a relationship based solely upon race. I have no idea where Obama stands on anything. He’s copied so many of Hillary’s policies and with regard to AA issues he says nothing. I would not attend a church like his or listen to Wright week after week. So why would I support Obama? He wants AAs to believe he identifies with them on the same level as Wright and he wants the white community to believe the opposite. His campaign people finally convince him that he could distance himself from Wright without losing black support. So he put his trusty bus in gear.
He’s hustling his election with vague concepts while flattering a needy, misinformed, Hillary/Bill Clinton-hating electorate who have been conditioned to choose candidates the way they would choose a soft drink. This is not my idea of how to elect a president. Especially after George Bush.
I’m at the point where I’m seriously questioning whether I can live in a country filled with people this stupid.
Mimi….I have been eyeing Canada since 2000. Now that my daughter is 18 it is lookin like a cozy place…..I’d head south which is closer and easier but I prefer to stick with the English foundation of the legal system……This among other things is where relocation to another country can get tricky….
[…] Things we wish we’d written: Case #2 Posted on April 30, 2008 by katiebird Joanne Parrent at No Quarter must have been listening in to a conversation with one of my sisters: A Family Fight or a License to Hate? […]
Excellent post, Joanne. I look forward to reading more of your work.
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The NY Post has corroborated what I wrote about yesterday: Wright was lashing out at Obama be