Digging the Hole Deeper
By Charles Lemos on May 23, 2008 at 8:00 PM in Barack Obama, Bill Richardson, Iran, John McCain
Trying to dig himself out of hole on his willingness to meet with global villians face to face without precondition, Obama stutters some more:
Obama objected on CNN this week to “this obsession with Ahmadinejad” and explained guardedly: “I would be willing to meet with Iranian leaders if we had done sufficient preparations for that meeting.
“Whether Ahmadinejad is the right person to meet with right now, we don’t even know how much power he is going to have a year from now,” Obama added. “He is not the most powerful person in Iran.”
He said he would expect “to meet with those people who can actually make decisions” in Iran on its nuclear program, its aid to terrorists and destabilization in Iraq.
Well true, the Ayotollah Khomeini is the Supreme Leader of Iran but he doesn’t run the day-to-day affairs of the Iranian government. Ahmadinejad has more day-to-day control and while the Ayotallah Khomenini is likely to sign off on any high level contact between the United States and the Islamic Republic, it is unlikely that the Iranians would want to exclude Ahmadinejad from those deliberations.
And who in Iran is going to be willing to meet with a President Obama if Ahmadinejad is being purposefully excluded from a meeting?
And the “experienced’ foreign affairs expert Bill Richardson is beyond lame with this argument:
New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, for one, is drawing distinctions between Iran and Cuba.
A veteran of semiofficial negotiations with dictators, he said Obama should be open to meeting Cuban President Raul Castro, but “I think you don’t talk to Ahmadinejad. You talk to some of the moderate clerics.”
Those conversations with moderate clerics would have to be, ipso facto, behind close doors and through back channesl. For which cleric in Iran is going accept a public meeting with Obama that sidesteps the leadership of Iran? This is the most inane argument I have ever heard. From Richardson? This is sheer stupidity and they are giving McCain an opening.
As I have said before, many issues that have not been an issue in the Democratic primary for a variety of reasons from media bias to Clinton’s unwillingness to really crucify Obama will jump to the fore-front in the general election.
In this instance, Obama’s comments from July 2007 at the Citadel CNN/Youtube Debate are now front and center in the campaign. Furthermore they are likely to stay front and center because the GOP won’t let go of them. And Obama doesn’t play defense very well, does he? The Obama camp keeps on digging themselves a deeper hole.
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Ahhh Blessed Be the Thread Makers!
There is a COL.[retd]going around the blogss posting a loooooooooong drivel singing the greatness of BH Obama. His name is A.M.Khajawall M.D.and he is a
Forensic Psychiatrist. The A stands for ALI. Look and see if you find the Freudian slip. Maybe it is code speak?
Yours sincerely,
COL.[retd] A.M.Khajawall M.D.
Forensic Psychiatrist.
Disables American Veteran.
Las Vegas Nevada.
Cell: 951-505-6975
His rant at the link (one location))
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/05/mccain_gets_clo.html51-505-6975
Hmmm, interesting. Does he sign all of his posts this way?
It’s a disaster.
And Clinton is best to let this play out.
If he is digging the hole, then we should fill it in.
well, as he is not the Supreme Leader of Iran, or the “most powerful person in Iran”, then all the less reason to send our top dog President to meet with him and dignify his insanity with the prestige of international attention.
And it is just too funny watching the obamabots trying inject this new talking point, “no preconditions doesn’t mean no preparation!”. LMAO.
No offense, but Obama is such a lightweight. None too bright either.
I don’t think I’ve ever observed anything this disgraceful, this obtuse.
At the very least, Bush had the Bakers.
Daschle, and the rest, are absolute garbage, third rate stringers, projecting their inner narcissistic dramas onto this mess of a campaign.
No sense of protocol, no moves, AT ALL, an absolute inability to even question how they’re being pushed.
When they say Chicago, they mean Chicago, in all it’s diplomatic, provincial glory.
No way this crew handles the middle east, they’re already marked as amatuers, worse than Bush.
Like Hamas, in the White House, Obama no more than a Hamas figurehead.
And on the world stage, that’s a diss.
Luckily the psycho Hillary haters (Lawrence O’Donnel) are small enough in number that the SCREAMS FOR HILLARY will DROWN THEM OUT!!
Those college kids are not HILLARY haters either. MOST Hillary haters used to be REPUBLICANS. What has amazed me through all this is the obvious admiration many on the Right now have for Sen. Clinton.
After this one sided fight. Her Strength and Ideas are strong enough and good enough to stand on their own.
Screw the haters! Hate will eat you up. They will fizzle and die. Become like Dennis Miller but on the Left. LOL - no longer relevant
Obama’s famous line, “THat’s not what I said”. He second famous line, “That’s not what I meant”.
Pst, Not Khomeini, but Khamenei, these are two different individuals. One is dead, one is the living Ayatollah.
thanks that’s what i get for trying to spell a Persian surname and not look it up.
Charles Lemos
San Francisco, CA
I’ll make the correction. Thanks for the catch.
Most people would wait until they were in office before getting into what specific enemies that they were going to meet with. Obama needs to go to foreign relations school. Fortunately, there is a fellow Senator or two in his own party that can school him. Right now, he should be sitting in the corner with a dunce cap on.
You mean he’s not the president already? I mean, he did all that hard stuff! You mean he’s got to do more? I thought we were just going to coronate him and skip the GE, in an Affirmative Action kind of way.
I know! He can use the Race Card and skip the election!
do these idiots not see that they are damaging the chance of a genuinely good aa candidate from winning for decades? the answer is maybe and they don’t care.
No shit.
But wait, he’s thinking ahead:
Obama is so cocksure of his success and abilities that he’s planning on 1. being president and 2. meeting with the most powerful person in Iran.
God save us. This old Democrat would feel much safer with McCain as president than Obama, although I’m not giving up on Hillary.
Girls kick ass!
and you don’t know if you’ll have any power at all in a year bambi
Open Letter To Republicans,
Dear Republicans,
Please assist us in ending Obama’s political career. We know that you have enjoyed watching the Democratic party destroy itself. You have laughed and eaten popcorn as factions developed and acrimony increased. We understand that. It’s a part of politics.
However, something greater than mere “politics” is at stake here. America is at stake here. You have seen many of us Clinton supporters state emphatically that we will vote for McCain if Obama is allowed to take this nomination.
We ask the same loyalty to America from you. Whatever our differences are, Obama is the greatest threat to America in her two hundred- some years.
We are not kidding when we express this viewpoint.
We believe that Hillary will win the Democratic nomination. But at this point, we need to protect America.
Obama is turning his jaundiced eye to McCain, as you well know. He is going to fight his slash and burn
style campaign on two fronts: ours and yours.
The damage that he has done to America already is staggering. The damage that he will do, as long as he is allowed to move forward, is incalculable.
It is no longer about winning between you Republicans and us concerned Democrats. It is about protecting our country from those who would use it
to advance their own destructive and self-promoting agendas.
I know some of you Republicans know this to be true.
But you are torn between playing out the political game you see before you, and following your better instincts to expose and end Obama’s slash and burn nomination run.
It is said that you possess information that will de-rail Obama once and for all. We have no stomach to see Obama turn and try to rip John McCain apart as he has attempted to do with our candidate, Hillary Clinton. John McCain does not deserve this treatment anymore than our candidate. Our country does not need to be a witness to any more of the hate and cynical divisiveness of Obama and his campaign.
Don’t play russian roulette with American’s future.
Regardless of who becomes President (Clinton or
McCain) the longer Obama remains in the race, the more damage we undergo as a nation.
So Republicans, please “pony up.”
If the american people allow this Manchurian candidate to become president, then they deserve what they get.
If we dont have the balls to stand up for and defend this country from within as well as without, then we do not deserve her.
AMEN! So glad I am not alone in seeing Obama for the absolute national security disaster he is- he is very very dangerous and backed by other despots in the making.
This is such a nightmare. I never imagined we would be calling a presidential candidate a national security disaster but it is the absolute truth.
obama has already shot his guns so to speak. what will he do? accuse mccain of being a racist? they’ll laugh at him. he can’t do the sexism role? in fact he is the whimp here. so what does he have? oh yeah, bush! well that will only fly so far. people are starting to be more afraid of him than mccain. he keeps manufacturing crap for us so we won’t be forgetting what a pathetic whining whimp he is.
Says it all!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-8an6a2_hU
that caroline is truly clueless. now i am for more diplomacy. the us under bush has been terrible about that. i admire nixon going to china and think that low key feelers to constructive talks is very good. but the obamatons scare me. they are so naive and arrogant!
By saying that Iran is tiny compared to the former Soviet Empire misses the whole point of what is Islamic Terrorism. It only takes one suicide bomber with a nuke or dirty bomb to change our whole way of life. As bad Bush has been I do give him credit for the most important issue facing our country. We have not been attacked since 911.
The far left wing have forgotten what we faced that September day. Obama is prepared to talk with our enemies while at the same time they develop and distribute nuclear devises to individual terrorists.
If Obama somehow gets to be president and we get attacked here in America or there is a regional Gulf war because of a fast pull out of Iraq the democrats will forever be held responsible. The permanent Republican majority that Rove speaks will be the new reality
Hillary is the only democrat that is pragmatic and strong on these issues. If the Clinton wing is exiled from the party the democrats will be weak on national security.
When your in the booth it all comes down to who will keep you safe.
Hillary has those credentials and so does McCain.
Good news. From Philly newspaper.
Lost in the excitement of Barack Obama’s coronation this week was an inconvenient fact of Tuesday’s results: Hillary Clinton netted approximately 150,000 votes and is now poised to finish the primary season as the popular-vote leader. In some quaint circles, presumably, these things still matter.
Real Clear Politics keeps track of six versions of the popular-vote total. They are, in ascending order of inclusivity: (1) the popular vote of sanctioned contests; (2) the total of sanctioned contests, plus estimated votes from the Iowa, Nevada, Maine and Washington caucuses; (3) the popular vote plus Florida; (4) popular vote plus Florida and the caucuses; (5) the popular vote plus Florida and Michigan; (6) popular vote plus Florida, Michigan, and the caucus estimates. After Tuesday, Clinton now leads in two of these six counts.
If you believe that the most important precept in democratic politics is to “count every vote,” then the sixth category is the most inclusive, and here Clinton leads Obama by 71,301 votes. Of course, this includes the Michigan result, where Sen. Obama had removed his name from the ballot. So while it may be the most inclusive, it may not be the most fair.
The third and fourth counts - the ones which include Florida - seem more fair. Here, Obama is clinging to a slight lead of 146,786 votes (257,008, with the caucus estimates). However, with Puerto Rico, Montana, and South Dakota remaining, he will almost certainly finish behind her in these counts, likely by a few hundred thousand votes.
But could Clinton take over the lead in all of the popular-vote tabulations? Quite possibly. In Puerto Rico’s last major election, two million people voted. Let’s assume that turnout for this historic vote - Puerto Rico has never had a presidential primary before - will be equal to or greater than that turnout.
If Clinton were to win Puerto Rico by 20 points she would pick up at least a 400,000-vote margin. This would allow her to swamp Obama in the popular-vote counts, which include Florida, making her the leader in four of the six permutations of the popular vote. At that point, Obama would be left clinging to the least-inclusive count, which he now leads by 441,558 votes (551,780, including caucuses).
To understand how razor-thin this majority is, consider that if the Puerto Rico turnout is slightly larger than we have imagined - or Clinton’s margin is slightly greater - then Clinton would finish the primary process leading in every conceivable vote count. With two million voters, a 28 percent victory would put Clinton over the top even in the count, which excludes Florida and Michigan and includes estimates for Obama’s caucus victories.
It is this looming prospect which explains the tremendous pressure Obama partisans and the media are putting on Clinton to drop out of the race. They want her gone now because they understand that she has an excellent chance of finishing as the undisputed people’s choice.
Would it matter if Clinton were the undisputed (or even disputed) popular-vote winner? That’s hard to say. The question is, matter to whom? The superdelegates will determine the nominee and there’s no telling what will sway them. They have no objective criteria from which to make their decisions. But if they were to deny the popular-vote champ the nomination, there is a real question of whether Democratic voters would reconcile themselves to the decision. As it is, much of the talk about Democratic defections in November has been overstated.
Partisan voters almost always come home after their candidate loses. The problem arises when a candidate’s supporters believe that their guy (or gal) didn’t lose. Expect the chorus calling for Clinton’s withdrawal to grow louder over the next week, with people insisting that she has no “path to victory.”
Clinton’s path is both obvious and simple: Win the popular vote and force Barack Obama and his cheerleaders to explain why that doesn’t matter.
I agree. This is her only path to nomination. That and a growing concern that Obama is unelectable.
I notice that many people are now tracking electoral college by head-to-head polls. It’s clear that Obama’s vast popularity and money making capabilities are not persuading a great many people. They don’t care about his money stuff. That’s for the politicians to drool over.
They DO care about Wright. They will care about Ayers. And he hasn’t made a great deal of sense about foreign policy. And he’s looking mighty scared by not resolving the FL and MI question while trying to campaign there.
I think many people are suspicious of his money and from which part of the world it comes. I am suspicious of a politician who has a seemingly endless supply of money.
I personally think he’s lying about it. But that’s just a gut feeling based on only one piece of real evidence.
Hillary was transparent all along regarding her corporate money. The press couldn’t get him to open up his bundled money for a very long time.
They had to really pry it out. My antenna was up right away, and sure enough, he’s got a lot of lobbyist money while pointing the finger and shaming Edwards and selling this silly story about Change.
He had no real message, in other words. It was a lie.
I figure if he’s willing to go to that length, then he’s darn sure willing to lie about his sources lately.
Who could refute it? Nobody. It’s quite easy to fudge sources.
i don’t see his supporters generally ponying up with that much cash. and the corporations? sure they’ll give some to him and to mccain. so the rest? that is the question!
The media is all over the Hillary statement today, you know not one of them is paying attention the the nonsense that Obama spoke about Cuba, his plans for Venezuela and Chevaz, the Caribbean and so on.
All this he said today, but here we have this hot news on Hillary and no constructive discussion on the nonsense that Obama spoke, the media has also blanked out Obama’s meeting in FL where he is trying to win over the Jew vote, I keep looking at the news for info on that but nothing, it seems that some people attending that event had Obama in the hot seat.
Once again nothing in the media, McCain is beating Obama in the polls not one word in the media on discussing this, all I keep hearing is what does Hillary want, Obama should not make her VP, Obama is the nominee, Bill looking to cut a deal with Obama.
Daily nonsense and nothing about the real issues at hand.
Lou Dobbs show went after Obama for lying about hate crimes. Obama looked very bad from what I saw in that report. There’s just enough friendly MSM to keep Hillary in the game.
Yo fuckers in the media! Guess what? RFK Jr. himself defended Hillary’s comments and repeated his unwavering support for her.
Take that mofos.
RRRRRrrrrrrrrighT On!!
Good for him, he’s an upstanding guy.
The poor schizo Obamabots are torn between their marching orders of being nice to us and their irresistible urge to be nasty to us. They are being told Obama is the nominee yet they are not quite sure about that when they see Hillary not going anywhere. And that pesky rules committee meeting. They just wish that just wasn’t so.
This is very tough time for the poor Obamabots. We should pity them in their moment of sorrow. They put forth a face of joy in their “nominee” but we know that’s a false face. Their true face is of anxiety over what the coming months will bring. Its a long time until Denver and a lot could happen between now and then. I hope Michelle brushed her teeth before going off on whitey in that video. We would not want to see her with a piece of corn stuck between her teeth or anything.
I’m not sure I believe the poll that says more of Obambi’s voters would vote for Hillary than vice versa………
but if for the sake of polls - it is true? Then we probably don’t want to antagonize them either. It’s only the haters that are even still hanging around on the most vile blogs like KOS (jmo)
Most voters have voted already for OBambi and gone back to their classes or lives. We may need them in Nov.
I’ve mostly seen the haters here trolling.
Oh for sure you can imagine the fear they have for No Quarter!!
I giggle just thinking of it!
the ones playing at being nice are haters also challenge them and stand back for the show.
“By saying that Iran is tiny compared to the former Soviet Empire misses the whole point of what is Islamic Terrorism.”
Exactly. Al Quaeda hit an American city, something neither Nazi Germany nor Imperial Japan could do, something neither the Soviet Union nor Communist China would have dared to do. And I do recall reading something somewhere about vital interests in the Middle East.
I’m too far behind to catch up tonight but has anyone seen any recent polls on South Dakota? Or MOntana?
I saw a few rallies w/Hillary and they looked pretty good.
Thank you Charles Lemos for a such a good and thoughtful post.
Obama is a pretender as far as I am concerned and his improvised remarks off the cuff are utmost irresponsible. and if they are not improvised then the more dangerous they are.
I cannot stop shaking my head to his comments on foreign policy. He really does not seem to grasp nor understand the complexity of the issues and problems at stake. It is obvious that he has not spend much time at all during his life studying and trying to understand the global problems that we live with today. He just reacts like a novice.
What is serious here is that he is not only digging a hole for himself but that if he were to be the US Presidency he will put all of us into a deeper and dangerous hole.
Ooops!!! You loser. Guess that explains why your dumb, gay ass no longer holds a federal job. Larry, why are you trying to divide my party, you not so long ago republican (less than 2 years ago)? No matter. What Sen. Obama said is that he would meet with certain leaders of named countries without pre-conditions BUT WITH preparation. Ahmadinejad, while President of Iran, is NOT the LEADER of Iran. Funny that all of you loser, haters forget that last part (especially you, Larry, you allegedly former governmental official). I know, you stand apart from those one tooth, meth-head, cracker-ass, crackers in WV and KY who voted for your insane, loser of a candidate. I also know that since you are a disgraceful, loser of a former governmental employee and it was impossible for you to read simple, uncomplicated news stories to figure out who is really in charge of Iran, you clearly could not understand the basic English articulated in the actual stories about the issue you raised (not the fictional accounts that you invented). I understand, you’re a Shrillary supporter; that’s what you delusional people do. You’re not as bright as the rest of America. Again, it does not matter. I too feel sorry for the mentally ill. As Joe Klein recently pointed out in Time Magazine (one of those highfalutin elitist paper documents that intelligent folk like me read) when he effectively demonstrated McCain’s (and now, your) ignorance of the Iranian hierarchy:
At the press conference, Klein asked McCain about this. Here’s the ensuing exchange, according to the Huffington Post:
Klein: [I've] checked with the Obama campaign and he never, he’s never said — mentioned Ahmadinejad directly by name. He did say he would negotiate with the leaders, but as you know — Ayatollah …
McCain: (Laughing) Ahmadinejad is, was the leader.
Klein: But if —
McCain: Maybe I’m mistaken.
Klein: Maybe you are, because —
McCain: Maybe. I don’t think so though.
Klein: The Supreme, you know, according to most diplomatic experts, the Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei is the guy who’s in charge of Iranian foreign policy and also in charge of the nuclear program, but you never mention him. Do you, you know, um, why do you always keep talking about Ahmadinejad, since he doesn’t have power in that, in that realm?
McCain: Oh I think — Again, I respectfully disagree. When he’s the person that comes to the United Nations and declares his country’s policy is the extermination of the state of Israel, quote, in his words, wipe them off of the map, then I know that he is speaking for the Iranian government and articulating their policy and he was elected and is running for reelection as the leader of that country … I mean, the fact is he’s the acknowledged leader of that country and you may disagree, but that’s, uh, that’s your right to do so. But I think if you asked any average American who the leader of Iran is, I think they’d know. Or anyone who’s well-versed in the issue.
So, Larry and other HRC supporters who buy Larry’s BS, the question is: Why do you hate diplomacy? Why must you lie? HRC’s political career is over. Let me guess, you people will, no matter what, insist that Klein has drunk the “kool-aid.” Even though Klein is firmly grounded in reality, unlike you delusional losers. OK. Don’t bother. Your reality is whatever you crazy old broads want to believe.
here folks is a good example of anyone but obama! next!
Haven’t had a chance to read the comments but thought this might be of interest since it’s somewhat related.
http://www.stop-obama.org/?p=418
Obama has so many red flags it’s mind boggling to me how he has made it so far. I’m very grateful to blogs like No Quarter for letting us know and question these things. You folks are true patriots.
Change of Subject: I’ve been wondering if any of the media bias, repeating of mistruths, and outright sexism breaks any broadcasting related laws. It seems strange that the Janet Jackson episode got so much attention and action from the FCC but this type of thing hasn’t. For example if some of these happened in corporate America it would not be tolerated and there would be ramifications (and for sure additional sensitivity training).
that obama and his dumb bunny supporters would actually think they can get prominent jewish supporters in the us to back him surprises me. of course there will be a few that don’t think clearly but most will see through this little charade.
Endorsements mean very little with independent thinkers. We really don’t care.
I know all year, I’ve just registered “trends” in endorsements. Hillary has huge backing from many core groups. Obama got wierd personalities, the Hillary-haters, the ones with the axes to grind, the odd-balls.
But I know among highly independent thinkers, endorsements are honestly unimportant.
I don’t care what they think. They don’t think for me.
Whenever I get angry, frustrated or depressed about the lynching the media and hussein camp are doing to Hillary, it is always uplifting to come here.
Charles Richardson is an ass. I would rather see him ride horses..at least that was funny.
This is a BO classic and deserves to be framed.
The split screen is up to about 20 frames …he is reckless and lacks any wisdom. I seriously dought he has ever read a book on Iran.
You can tell when a person is repeating what other people told him.
Great edition for the exhibition, Charles.